What if Mercedes wasn't so inviting?

emissary · Post by **emissary** » Fri Oct 28, 2005 8:37 pm

OK The words that the cop on the bench uses are very exciting to Ajax. What do you think Ajax would have done if, in response to "You feelin alright lady? You need a little help ore something lady" she said to get lost. Would he have attacked her or just told her to go fly a kite and caught up with the guys? I don't think he would have attacked her.

haterist · Post by **haterist** » Fri Oct 28, 2005 9:01 pm

emissary wrote:OK The words that the cop on the bench uses are very exciting to Ajax. What do you think Ajax would have done if, in response to "You feelin alright lady? You need a little help ore something lady" she said to get lost. Would he have attacked her or just told her to go fly a kite and caught up with the guys? I don't think he would have attacked her.

this is kind of a touchy subject since theres a few ladies on the board, so that being said....
i was actually going to raise this question cause i feel it was totally some entrapment BS. she led him on, saying things like, "have a seat ", "i like all those muscles" and "you wanna show me how you play...." i don't remember the exactly lines but you get my point.
this was totally acceptable to do this back in those days but nowdays if some cop tries to pull that BS, their the ones who are going to get in trouble.

to answer your question, i think Ajax would've left her alone if she hadn't come on so strong. i think he was a horn dog but i didn't see him as a rapist.

off topic but sort of on topic....

heres an unpopular opinion but this is how most guys feel but are afraid to say it....
i just found that entire scene disturbing, it reminds me of stories i'd hear of girls claiming they got raped for doing exactly what mercedes did in the flick. its not cool to be a tease whether you're a guy or girl, then claim rape when you get someone all worked up and they want a slice.
i'm not in any way saying rape is cool but sitting out on some park bench in the middle of night making nice with some random holligans walking about is not really the brightest thing to do IMHO....she was asking for it....like literally. its like when girls wear some skippy top showing off there boobs, then get mad at you if you look at them....WTF is that about?!?!?!

vermin76 · Post by **vermin76** » Fri Oct 28, 2005 9:33 pm

ajax was a person who took no crud from no one i would believe women were included.i think his reaction would be to knock the stuffing out of her then rape her.lets face it he was so darn horny i think he would have done a tree with a hole in it if he hadnt have met mercedes when he had.he was a loose cannon with no regard for respect or authority.as far as he was concerned he was king of the world and only took orders from one person..........himself.

Lady · Post by **Lady** » Sat Oct 29, 2005 7:11 pm

Beyond the comments on his muscles and such, I would think that comments like "show me how you play with the chicks" and "we'll get it on" would have made it entrapment, pure and simple. But as haterist pointed out, standards were different between the time the movie was made and now.

That's not to say that I think, if Ajax wanted a girl who wouldn't have anything to do with him, he'd be willing to take no for an answer. He's just not that kind of a guy in general.

haterist wrote: heres an unpopular opinion but this is how most guys feel but are afraid to say it....
i just found that entire scene disturbing, it reminds me of stories i'd hear of girls claiming they got raped for doing exactly what mercedes did in the flick. its not cool to be a tease whether you're a guy or girl, then claim rape when you get someone all worked up and they want a slice.
i'm not in any way saying rape is cool but sitting out on some park bench in the middle of night making nice with some random holligans walking about is not really the brightest thing to do IMHO....she was asking for it....like literally. its like when girls wear some skippy top showing off there boobs, then get mad at you if you look at them....WTF is that about?!?!?!

Count me in as a female in total agreement with you on that one.

And, on a lighter note:

vermin76 wrote:lets face it he was so darn horny i think he would have done a tree with a hole in it

That made me laugh out loud, for real.

emissary · Post by **emissary** » Sat Oct 29, 2005 7:19 pm

I remember thinking that Ajax seemed so shy with her at first. Like he was all talk and didn't really know what to say to a lady.

Wolverine · Post by **Wolverine** » Sat Oct 29, 2005 8:55 pm

There are no excuses you can make for behavior like Ajax's. Everyone was smart enough and strong enough to resist the 'temptation' except for Ajax. He had it coming.

It was that lady's job to lure in 'predators' like Ajax. She did her job.

The Warriors 9 · Post by **The Warriors 9** » Sat Oct 29, 2005 9:38 pm

This scene has bothered me from the first time I've seen it. Pure entrapment. Even my wife has agreed with me on this. I remember her saying that the first time we seen it (in 79) and she walked in on or just before that part while my sons and I were watching the directors cut and said it again. (Hey we almost never agree on nothin so I remember things like that). I'm with most of you to don't think he would have forced himself on her if she would have shut him down.

Hated to see my fav charactor go out like this. Should have been in it to the end!

Wolverine · Post by **Wolverine** » Sat Oct 29, 2005 10:17 pm

Had she shut him down, he still would've gone after her. He obviously wasn't respectful towards her when she started fighting back. Why would he have been respectful towards her if she said no? We aren't talking about a nice guy here. You can't defend Ajax's behavior. As I said earlier, she was just doing her job, as a cop, to lure these bad guys in and get them off the streets. She can't be faulted for doing her job. Don't take the blame off Ajax.

Ranchgal · Post by **Ranchgal** » Sun Oct 30, 2005 1:59 am

I agree Wolverine!!
No I don't think it was entrapment, and if she would have NOT talked to him, chances are he would NOT have gone away either. He would have come closer and closer making dumber and dumber statements until she would not have been able to ignore him.

Undercover cops have to act like that, but IF he wasn't looking for trouble, and wasn't looking to handle her, he would not have stopped in the first place, and he certainly would not have backtracked and made a special effort to make conversation---he would have gone on with the rest of the guys---she did NOT hail them or ask them to do anything----UNTIL after he came back and started the conversation---right there---it was her job to find out if he was really was innocently offering help, or if he had alterior motives---which he did, and she found out soon enough.
He may not have started so roughly until she encouraged the conversation, but I can't believe that he would have NOT forced her in the end, once he ever made physical contact. It was all he wanted, and he as much as told the rest of the gang he was going to have his way with her. the fact that she outmanuvered him was more luck--good thing she was trained to concentrate on her objective, because fighting him off would have quickly become very very difficult.I

emissary · Post by **emissary** » Sun Oct 30, 2005 2:17 am

This is a tough one because its hard to defend him without sounding like you agree with his action. He was wrong, I know it, its just tough to let Ajax go.

Ranchgal · Post by **Ranchgal** » Sun Oct 30, 2005 5:15 am

I have to agree with you there---Poor James R.---I really felt bad for him when he said HE hated to have Ajax go down!!
not nice, but necessary---and TOO BAD!!!!

emissary · Post by **emissary** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 12:28 am

Yeah, its like, Walter could have made it easier for us to judge by not making Mercedes say what she said the way she said it. Especially that "You wanna show me...." line.

Ranchgal · Post by **Ranchgal** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 3:44 am

given all the things we have found to debate about within this movie, I don't think WH wanted to make it easier for us!!

Ben · Post by **Ben** » Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:01 am

Changing the subject very slightly, a question I've always had about that scene is what would the woman have done if Ajax wasn't so rough in that scene? Would she just say "well he's not a predator, just looking for a good time" and left? I think she would have cuffed him no matter what. It was a trap to catch gang members pure and simple. Now this does not justify Ajax's actions and general attitude towards her as a woman, and I do believe he deserved to get "busted" for it, but it just seems to me that even if she had lured a gang member who wasn't anything like Ajax it would have ended the same way.

MercysPinkTop · Post by **MercysPinkTop** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 3:28 pm

Doesn't Ajax say something to the effect of "Doesn't she know it's not safe after dark" or something or am I totally manufacturing that memory?

And doesn't he say something like "it's free" or "it's free for the taking"?

Those things, if they happened, combined with "I like it rough", lead me to conclude that Ajax was gonna try to get action one way or another.

As a side note, I watched this again the other day (which says my memory sucks for remembering lines) but once he gets cuffed it cracks me up. It's like he transforms from Ajax to Greg Brady. "Come on lady..." "You don't want to mess with me lady..." and then he tries to drag the bench like a dumbass. And then after he gets knocked over, he looks up with his puppy dog eyes and slurs "f****n wimp". Greg Brady. It makes me smile.

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